Saturday, August 7, 2010
Toot Toot!
Time to toot my own horn as Koda would say. A splendiferous LDS friend of mine asked me to write a piece about my deconversion for her blog. Most of the readers are LDS and they have been great. Have a peek if you want, the discussion going on there is quite interesting. I am learning a lot.
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I'm not anonymous - this is Angry Baker:) Thanks again for doing this for me. And I've been thinking about my last comment on my blog and I need to stand by what I said first - that this is your space to talk unedited without worrying about what the LDS snoops are feeling. We can opt in, when and if we want. I think I back paddled a bit with the whole hurt feelings comment, because honestly that is very fleeting and this isn't about me, it's about you and your experience.
ReplyDeleteHopefully that was clearer.
Peace out.
I loved reading more about your story. I find myself more and more relating to this aspect of leaving:
ReplyDelete"I am still dealing with the loss of a parent and a brother. A kind and loving heavenly father who would comfort me when I was lost, an elder brother who loved me like crazy… both of whom were going to welcome me back into their arms and tell me “Well done, thou good and faithful servant”. That bloody hurts. I am learning to give myself the love that I imagined came from them but really came from me all along."
Thanks Angry Baker xox I feel as though you and I have a pretty good idea of where the other one is coming from now. I had no problem with the end of your last comment on 'A Departure'. I am having a blast and feel ever so privileged to be receiving such honest comments from everyone. I can tell that there is a real desire from everyone there to understand the 'other side', Loving it.
ReplyDeleteHey Kiley :D
ReplyDeleteIt's big stuff isn't it. You know what? I think I have finally come out of that pesky (but probably necessary) angry phase we've been blogging about.... and do you know what? I think it was my dear Mormon friend over at Chaos Theory who did it! I feel so light and happy.
Grr...
ReplyDeleteI went, I read, I soapboxed, I subscribed and I left.
Haven't you given your pound of flesh already?
Religion is BAD for humankind.
Maureen, I truly enjoyed reading your story. I am sorry that you have had some rough times. It seem like we all do when we turn away from what has always been taught as the truth. Finding friends like you online really helps.
ReplyDeleteHi Maureen! That was an excellent guest post and I think you were very brave to do it. I don’t think I am brave enough to put myself and my views out there for others to (possibly) criticize. I am pleased with how civil and kind the comments were though.
ReplyDeleteThe subject of friendship between TBM and ex-Mormons is a very interesting one. I think that friendships can exist, but I’m not sure that true honesty on both sides can occur. But, then again, I don’t know that true honesty can exist in friendships without hurt feelings, religion aside. I have a good friend who I have always disagreed with when it comes to her parenting style. This is something that we don’t really talk about because she feels that her parenting is right and I feel that my parenting is right. If she asks me for advice I will give it, but she usually just wants a shoulder to cry on and I am happy to be there for her. That is what I think is my job as her friend, to be there for her, not to tell her whether I think that what she is doing is wrong; because that is just my opinion.
It’s the same with the church. My opinion is that the church is not true, but she feels that it is. We do skirt a lot of issues as far as the church is concerned, and we are careful about how we speak to each other so as to not offend the other or cause hurt feelings. I guess at some point you have to ask yourself if the friendship is worth the effort. For me it is, with this friend. I hope things will get easier between us as far as church related issues go. I think that if both parties are willing to make it work it can.
You summed it up well when you said “I think that it would require the TBM to be open to hearing things they might not be comfortable with and it would require the apostate to be respectful. A difficult line to tread but not impossible and certainly worth it if the friendship is real.” Well done!
You didn't like what you saw over there TGIAA?
ReplyDeleteI am really encouraged by the interaction going on. Yes the commenters there possibly have an additional incentive to keep things civil since they know Angry Baker and I are pals and I too want to keep things high brow since most of the commenters there are Angry Baker's family and friends. But I am finding this to be a very unique and useful environment in which to discuss the manageability of relationships between TBMs and ex-mo's.
I might not like religion but that is a new standing point for me and active LDS still value religion so in this particular thread ('A Departure') I am keen to discuss the possibility of breaking down barriers and having a good dialogue between LDS and ex (especially since I still have family and friends in the church).
Heya Bowie, thanks. I have really enjoyed the experience thus far. I feel as though it is helping me to sort through some of the pain that I felt when I was rejected by my local LDS community.
It is also amazing to me how helpful it is to be in communication with fellow ex-mo's even though we have never met. The online support is a great benefit (p.s. have you seen the 'trip' that is being planned on fb for a tour of Utah and Australia?).
Hi TGW, that's a great point about the parenting styles. Reminds me of just how often we do keep our opinions to ourselves. Sometimes there is a place for advice or questioning but yes, there does seem to be a social need for us to hold back in order to maintain friendships. It's not just religion that rubs people the wrong way. I wonder though, some people believe that you can say anything so long as it is said with the right intention and with love. Is that just hippie-rainbow stuff or can it be done?
Beautiful post over there, Maureen! Thanks for sharing. I'm still in the "leaving" phase. I'm totally out mentally, but the only people that really know are my parents and a couple of my siblings. DH's parents and family and all of our TBM friends have no idea...so I'm really wondering how it's all going to fallout here over the next little bit as it all comes out. Will we go through what you have gone through or will it go better? It's really scary to think about. But at the same time I really want it all aired out so we can be us when we're around everyone. See who of our TBM friends will still want to be around us, etc.
ReplyDeleteI also had a recent experience with a friend who completely lambasted a parenting technique my dh and I did. It was not done tactfully and thus I don't think our friendship will survive. She couldn't allow us to agree to disagree.
I also think about my friendships over the years and I've never had one friend that I felt I could share everything with. There was one friend i could talk to about boys and then another I could talk to about school stuff or church stuff. Just interesting to think about what really makes a true friend. One that sticks with you despite it all even with the many disagreements and world views? That would be my pick.
Anyhoo, totally rambled on long enough! Great posts and wonderful blog!
Thanks Kaylanamars. It's a strange experience that's for sure. I don't think anyone is ever really prepared for the fall-out. At least you get to see who your real friends are... and I never thought this would ever happen but you even get to see who your real family is. I have come to terms that blood is not always thicker than water. Mormonism is a strong pull for those still stuck in it and they somehow manage to hurt family in order to maintain their religious identity. A complete shock to me.
ReplyDeleteI've had that experience with a friend about parenting. We ended up not associating for a while (a couple of months) and then just picked up where we left off. So I guess we ignored the problem. I'd like to think that I would handle things differently now and stand up for myself. Leaving the Mormon church toughened me up a bit.
Yeah, a good friend is hard to come by. I feel very lucky to have 3 sisters with whom I can share pretty much anything. I'm trying to think now if I would keep things from them. I think there are things everyone keeps to themselves and never tells a soul. Other than that I can talk quite freely with my sisters.
Thanks for the praise! I checked out your blog too and liked what I saw, I'll keep in touch :D